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limmk · 22-08-2004, 08:12 PM

What causes a person to have Never Been Kissed?

THEY have never held hands, been hugged or fallen in love. They are the Never Been Kissed - adult Singaporeans who have never known a romantic relationship.

There are, of course, no official figures on this group, though 2003 statistics show that 550,000 Singaporeans in their 20s and older remain single.

Many singles are not short of a love life, choosing to hold off marriage till the right mate comes along. The same, however, cannot be said of the Never Been Kissed, a group whose plight - if it can be called that - generates pity, sarcasm or scorn among family, friends and even strangers.

So it is no surprise then that most of the seven Never Been Kissed interviewed by LifeStyle refused to reveal their full names.

'Society doesn't think well of us,' says Sharon, a 30-year-old human resource executive. 'It's bad enough if you're single and in your 30s to 40s, but to have never dated before? We're regarded as cantankerous weirdos who are difficult to get along with. It's not fair.'

It's anyone's guess how many Never Been Kissed exist, but matchmaking agencies say up to three in 10 people they see fit this profile.

They come from all walks of life, are in their late 20s to 40s and hold jobs ranging from coffee shop cooks to even doctors. The reasons for their situation could range from strong religious beliefs that prevent them from forming romantic relationships, to just a lack of opportunity.

Mr Mark Lim of Sin Ye International Matchmaker at Katong Shopping Centre says that out of the five men who seek Vietnamese brides at his agency each month, two would have never been in a relationship.

'They often have little education, work odd jobs, feel very inferior and don't think that they can find Singaporean wives,' he says. 'Some work inflexible hours so they find it troublesome to date. So, they spend $16,000 for a bride.'

Then there are the white-collar Never Been Kissed.

Ms Violet Lim, founder of Lunch Actually, says about 10 per cent of the 20 to 25 people who visit her matchmaking agency each week fall under this category. 'Some might not be as extroverted as the rest of our members. But they're eligible,' she says.

For an annual fee of $780, participants of Lunch Actually get at least 15 lunch dates fixed by the agency, which is based in Clifford Centre.

Psychologist Daniel Koh of Mount Elizabeth-Charter Behavioural Health Services says he sees an average of one to two patients a month who have never ever dated.

They visit the clinic for anxiety or depression problems, and will later reveal that they have not had relationships.

'We need to explore what the trigger factors are - is it because of stress, abuse as a child or low self-esteem? And then we'll try to counsel them,' he says.

While trigger factors may vary, experts say that the Never Been Kissed might generally suffer from conditions such as social anxiety disorders and an avoidant personality.

About 2 per cent of Singaporeans are severely afflicted by such disorders, says Associate Professor Calvin Fones from the National University Hospital.

'The layman will label it as low self-esteem or shyness,' says the chief of its psychological medicine department. 'But in the clinical context, we believe such people have a strong sense of anxiety and fear of being negatively evaluated and scrutinised by others.'

He adds: 'Obviously there's no 'danger' to being such a single person. But it's all about whether their quality of life will suffer. Singlehood can take on rather different implications when one ages.'

Elbow ecstasy

EXPERTS say that those who want to get out of their situation should proceed slowly. Rather than asking a girl or boy out, they should take small - and less intimidating - steps first. For example, they could broaden their social circle through activities like dancing lessons.

Mount Elizabeth also offers counselling sessions, while support groups such as Singles Connect organise motivational workshops.

But there seems to be a stoic resignation from the Never Been Kissed we interviewed. While they still hope to find mates, some say they are equally happy with being single and romantically unattached.

Teacher Carrie Yeo, 34, for instance, says that although she has gone for 10 matchmaking sessions arranged by a dating agency and friends, she has yet to find a mate.

The closest she came to having a boyfriend was 10 years ago when she hung out with a man from dance classes organised by the Social Development Unit, the Government's matchmaking organisation for graduates.

'There was this time when we crossed the road and he held my elbow. My heart was thumping like there was deer stampeding all over it,' she remembers wistfully. 'But he was posted briefly to Germany for work and we gradually lost touch.'

These days, she is happy just relying on herself and the company of friends. 'My age doesn't allow me to fantasise anymore,' she says. 'If you have a partner, it's a year-end bonus. If not, we still have a comfortable salary.'

Ultimately, just like other singles, the Never Been Kissed have to create their chances to find happiness.

MP Irene Ng, who is president of Singles Connect, a group set up in October 2001 as a support network for the unmarried, says: 'Singles wonder why they're alone on Valentine's Day, for instance.

'If you're a Never Been Kissed and want to be kissed, you must take a personal initiative to go out and find a partner.

'If you need help, there are various channels to go to. But you shouldn't be forced into it.'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The idiot, the iceman and me

WHEN her friends played the game 'truth or dare' while holidaying in Bangkok in May, Sharon found that she had nothing to kiss and tell.

When the beer bottle spun on the bar table and pointed to her three friends, each coughed up secrets about his or her social and sexual life.

But when the bottle pointed to her, her friends were hard-pressed to ask her anything.

Sharon, 30, has never dated, much less had sex.

'I told them to skip me because I have nothing to say,' the petite human resource executive tells LifeStyle.

'While I felt a bit bad holding back the game, it felt good, too, to have a clean slate and to gleefully listen to the sordid details of my friends' lives.'

But others are not so accepting of her status.

'Those outside my circle of church friends make it a big deal about me not dating and being a virgin. They think I'm repressed.

'It's almost as if dating and sex is a seventh sense. Everybody's using it, and if you don't, you're somehow handicapped. But my philosophy is - what you don't know, you don't miss.'

The fun-loving Singaporean had read her fair share of romance novels as a teenager. She had a crush on a boy in her junior college soccer team and would attend his matches, rain or shine.

There were also a few chances at relationships which didn't come to pass.

'There was this 32-year-old accountant who'd give me a shoulder massage and tell me we're like brother and sister,' she recalls. 'He was giving me all these mixed signals, and now I just call him 'the idiot'.

'Then there was this guy who'd wait for me outside my house for two hours with two pints of Haagen Dazs ice-cream in an ice box, but he freaked me out.'

But did the lack of dating experience make her miss the signals from interested guys?

'I do kick myself sometimes wondering what could have been,' she says. 'But dating isn't something you should continue practising for fear of being out of tune. Things should just happen naturally.'

Nonetheless, being single did take a toll on her self-confidence, and she went through a bout of depression in her mid-20s.

She turned to religion for solace.

'I wonder sometimes if I'm human,' says Sharon, a Catholic. 'But I find that through prayer, I find peace.

'Things happen for a reason. Instead of moping and asking 'Why can't I find a decent man?', I should make the most of my singlehood to travel and be happy.'

Indeed, when we met her on Tuesday, she had just come back from a trip to Egypt, and is currently in Bintan.

'I still have my friends, so I'm lucky. One of my friends envisions me eventually dying in my home alone with my dog eating part of my face and mahjong tiles strewn over the floor.

'But what's to say that the same won't happen to him even if he has a wife and kids?'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Missed the boat

JANE is a 55-year-old statistical assistant who lives with her 85-year-old mother in a Housing Board flat in the Balestier area.

Her father, a technician, died in 1990. He was 75.

Jane, a bespectacled woman with curly hair and a kind smile, says she never dated in her youth.

'I just went out with friends to picnics,' she says in a mix of Mandarin and English. 'Or I'd divide my time between studies and giving tuition.'

She did her A levels at the pre-university centre in Nan Chiau High School.

Entering the working world didn't improve her chances at romance. She says she can't remember many details of her social life when she was in her 20s and 30s, and that love eluded her because she was juggling work and taking care of her parents.

'It's too late to start looking for someone now. At our age, how do you find someone who'll take care of a woman and her Mum?'

Work and household chores take up most of her weekdays. On weekends, the Catholic devotes her time to church.

'Many of my colleagues are also like me and are single. Work is very stressful so they're happy to go back home and have some quiet time.'

As to whether she regrets not having children, she says she pins all her hopes on the offspring of her five siblings.

'I used to take care of them when they were young,' she says of her nine nieces and nephews. 'They call me kai ma (Cantonese for godmother) and visit often.'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I love my violin more

ACCLAIMED Singaporean violinist Min Lee has never dated.

After all, she has to juggle daily five-hour practices, go for music classes at the University of Michigan and perform in concerts around the world.

But that doesn't mean the 21-year-old, who has signed on with recording label Universal Music, is not looking for love.

'I appreciate cute boys, too,' says the violinist who started playing the instrument when she was two. 'But I've made my choice to focus on my career. Besides, the special one hasn't come along yet.'

She entered the Oberlin Conservatory of the Oberlin College in the United States at 13, but was barred from staying in the dormitory. 'The school was afraid of the bad dating influences that 17- to 18-year-old American girls could have on me.'

She stayed with her mother off campus.

At Yale University, where she received her degree in music, she hung out with single female friends and older guys, who never made her feel weird about not dating.

'My Mum takes charge of my career but she's no dragon lady,' Lee says. 'She'll be like 'go, go, go' for dates, and I'll say 'no, no, no'.'

Her 'special one' will, however, have to play second fiddle to Filly, her $1 million Filius Andreas Guarnerius violin.

'If I'm in a sinking ship caught between my boyfriend and Filly, I'll jump in after Filly.

'Hopefully my boyfriend can swim because my violin definitely can't.'

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/lif...68413,00.html?

EjX · 22-08-2004, 08:18 PM

wow.. long article. anyway, ive no prejudice against anyone who've nv been kissed or dated before.
but juz like to share a lil thing.. i hav a friend who had a gf for 3yrs.. n they NEVER KISSED. Onli a mere hug....
So i tink such ppl r worse than those who nv had a relationship.

^A|eX^ · 22-08-2004, 08:23 PM

maybe kt can start a match making agency leh.

:fk:

Nbro · 22-08-2004, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ^A|eX^

maybe kt can start a match making agency leh.

:fk:

wahahaha~

when will it start...

Nbro · 22-08-2004, 08:48 PM

anyway, some pple dun have time...... some pple are afraid.... mb seen different pple and know their problems.... so dun dare to take gf/bf.... hence the late r/s or wat....

j20_sg · 22-08-2004, 08:52 PM

....4 more yrs be4 i go into that category!~

BlueWater · 22-08-2004, 09:11 PM

so what a chim report...

antartica · 22-08-2004, 10:01 PM

this is interesting... i'm now pushing 30 in a coupla years now. and i've dated several before and of have done many things in my life
and after reading the article. i think that it would acfually be nice to be 30 and have a clean slate like what Sharon said...
but damn me if i have to spend 16K on a viet wife!

We|sAu · 22-08-2004, 10:16 PM

eh..anyone can summarise for me anot..very long lehz..read til giddy..den gif up le..

^A|eX^ · 22-08-2004, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nbro

wahahaha~

when will it start...

duno leh...ask Boss....lor

hahhaa

:fk:

We|sAu · 22-08-2004, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ^A|eX^

maybe kt can start a match making agency leh.

:fk:

act no need start match making agency lahz..
coz kit is sumhow already a match making agency in some sense..
it has already created a lot of opportunities for many members here..
and we oso can see successful cases...

jnifur · 22-08-2004, 11:06 PM

The society is biased against pple who dun marry and lead the correct circle of life.

How pathetic. Who are they to judge? Why pple who choose the alternatives are often viewed as freaks?
Dun marry is wrong, marry is rite. Who will be in the rite position to say that?

devilcup · 22-08-2004, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jnifur

The society is biased against pple who dun marry and lead the correct circle of life.

How pathetic. Who are they to judge? Why pple who choose the alternatives are often viewed as freaks?
Dun marry is wrong, marry is rite. Who will be in the rite position to say that?

most impt is to have kids rite?

jnifur · 22-08-2004, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilcup

most impt is to have kids rite?

HAHAHA
exactly!

ACURA · 23-08-2004, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilcup

most impt is to have kids rite?

means wat?
the reason of getting married is jus to have kids?

22-08-2004, 08:12 PM	#1
limmk Status: 老色鬼 Join Date: Apr 2003 Age: 36 Posts: 733	A kiss is still a miss What causes a person to have Never Been Kissed? THEY have never held hands, been hugged or fallen in love. They are the Never Been Kissed - adult Singaporeans who have never known a romantic relationship. There are, of course, no official figures on this group, though 2003 statistics show that 550,000 Singaporeans in their 20s and older remain single. Many singles are not short of a love life, choosing to hold off marriage till the right mate comes along. The same, however, cannot be said of the Never Been Kissed, a group whose plight - if it can be called that - generates pity, sarcasm or scorn among family, friends and even strangers. So it is no surprise then that most of the seven Never Been Kissed interviewed by LifeStyle refused to reveal their full names. 'Society doesn't think well of us,' says Sharon, a 30-year-old human resource executive. 'It's bad enough if you're single and in your 30s to 40s, but to have never dated before? We're regarded as cantankerous weirdos who are difficult to get along with. It's not fair.' It's anyone's guess how many Never Been Kissed exist, but matchmaking agencies say up to three in 10 people they see fit this profile. They come from all walks of life, are in their late 20s to 40s and hold jobs ranging from coffee shop cooks to even doctors. The reasons for their situation could range from strong religious beliefs that prevent them from forming romantic relationships, to just a lack of opportunity. Mr Mark Lim of Sin Ye International Matchmaker at Katong Shopping Centre says that out of the five men who seek Vietnamese brides at his agency each month, two would have never been in a relationship. 'They often have little education, work odd jobs, feel very inferior and don't think that they can find Singaporean wives,' he says. 'Some work inflexible hours so they find it troublesome to date. So, they spend $16,000 for a bride.' Then there are the white-collar Never Been Kissed. Ms Violet Lim, founder of Lunch Actually, says about 10 per cent of the 20 to 25 people who visit her matchmaking agency each week fall under this category. 'Some might not be as extroverted as the rest of our members. But they're eligible,' she says. For an annual fee of $780, participants of Lunch Actually get at least 15 lunch dates fixed by the agency, which is based in Clifford Centre. Psychologist Daniel Koh of Mount Elizabeth-Charter Behavioural Health Services says he sees an average of one to two patients a month who have never ever dated. They visit the clinic for anxiety or depression problems, and will later reveal that they have not had relationships. 'We need to explore what the trigger factors are - is it because of stress, abuse as a child or low self-esteem? And then we'll try to counsel them,' he says. While trigger factors may vary, experts say that the Never Been Kissed might generally suffer from conditions such as social anxiety disorders and an avoidant personality. About 2 per cent of Singaporeans are severely afflicted by such disorders, says Associate Professor Calvin Fones from the National University Hospital. 'The layman will label it as low self-esteem or shyness,' says the chief of its psychological medicine department. 'But in the clinical context, we believe such people have a strong sense of anxiety and fear of being negatively evaluated and scrutinised by others.' He adds: 'Obviously there's no 'danger' to being such a single person. But it's all about whether their quality of life will suffer. Singlehood can take on rather different implications when one ages.' Elbow ecstasy EXPERTS say that those who want to get out of their situation should proceed slowly. Rather than asking a girl or boy out, they should take small - and less intimidating - steps first. For example, they could broaden their social circle through activities like dancing lessons. Mount Elizabeth also offers counselling sessions, while support groups such as Singles Connect organise motivational workshops. But there seems to be a stoic resignation from the Never Been Kissed we interviewed. While they still hope to find mates, some say they are equally happy with being single and romantically unattached. Teacher Carrie Yeo, 34, for instance, says that although she has gone for 10 matchmaking sessions arranged by a dating agency and friends, she has yet to find a mate. The closest she came to having a boyfriend was 10 years ago when she hung out with a man from dance classes organised by the Social Development Unit, the Government's matchmaking organisation for graduates. 'There was this time when we crossed the road and he held my elbow. My heart was thumping like there was deer stampeding all over it,' she remembers wistfully. 'But he was posted briefly to Germany for work and we gradually lost touch.' These days, she is happy just relying on herself and the company of friends. 'My age doesn't allow me to fantasise anymore,' she says. 'If you have a partner, it's a year-end bonus. If not, we still have a comfortable salary.' Ultimately, just like other singles, the Never Been Kissed have to create their chances to find happiness. MP Irene Ng, who is president of Singles Connect, a group set up in October 2001 as a support network for the unmarried, says: 'Singles wonder why they're alone on Valentine's Day, for instance. 'If you're a Never Been Kissed and want to be kissed, you must take a personal initiative to go out and find a partner. 'If you need help, there are various channels to go to. But you shouldn't be forced into it.' -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The idiot, the iceman and me WHEN her friends played the game 'truth or dare' while holidaying in Bangkok in May, Sharon found that she had nothing to kiss and tell. When the beer bottle spun on the bar table and pointed to her three friends, each coughed up secrets about his or her social and sexual life. But when the bottle pointed to her, her friends were hard-pressed to ask her anything. Sharon, 30, has never dated, much less had sex. 'I told them to skip me because I have nothing to say,' the petite human resource executive tells LifeStyle. 'While I felt a bit bad holding back the game, it felt good, too, to have a clean slate and to gleefully listen to the sordid details of my friends' lives.' But others are not so accepting of her status. 'Those outside my circle of church friends make it a big deal about me not dating and being a virgin. They think I'm repressed. 'It's almost as if dating and sex is a seventh sense. Everybody's using it, and if you don't, you're somehow handicapped. But my philosophy is - what you don't know, you don't miss.' The fun-loving Singaporean had read her fair share of romance novels as a teenager. She had a crush on a boy in her junior college soccer team and would attend his matches, rain or shine. There were also a few chances at relationships which didn't come to pass. 'There was this 32-year-old accountant who'd give me a shoulder massage and tell me we're like brother and sister,' she recalls. 'He was giving me all these mixed signals, and now I just call him 'the idiot'. 'Then there was this guy who'd wait for me outside my house for two hours with two pints of Haagen Dazs ice-cream in an ice box, but he freaked me out.' But did the lack of dating experience make her miss the signals from interested guys? 'I do kick myself sometimes wondering what could have been,' she says. 'But dating isn't something you should continue practising for fear of being out of tune. Things should just happen naturally.' Nonetheless, being single did take a toll on her self-confidence, and she went through a bout of depression in her mid-20s. She turned to religion for solace. 'I wonder sometimes if I'm human,' says Sharon, a Catholic. 'But I find that through prayer, I find peace. 'Things happen for a reason. Instead of moping and asking 'Why can't I find a decent man?', I should make the most of my singlehood to travel and be happy.' Indeed, when we met her on Tuesday, she had just come back from a trip to Egypt, and is currently in Bintan. 'I still have my friends, so I'm lucky. One of my friends envisions me eventually dying in my home alone with my dog eating part of my face and mahjong tiles strewn over the floor. 'But what's to say that the same won't happen to him even if he has a wife and kids?' -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Missed the boat JANE is a 55-year-old statistical assistant who lives with her 85-year-old mother in a Housing Board flat in the Balestier area. Her father, a technician, died in 1990. He was 75. Jane, a bespectacled woman with curly hair and a kind smile, says she never dated in her youth. 'I just went out with friends to picnics,' she says in a mix of Mandarin and English. 'Or I'd divide my time between studies and giving tuition.' She did her A levels at the pre-university centre in Nan Chiau High School. Entering the working world didn't improve her chances at romance. She says she can't remember many details of her social life when she was in her 20s and 30s, and that love eluded her because she was juggling work and taking care of her parents. 'It's too late to start looking for someone now. At our age, how do you find someone who'll take care of a woman and her Mum?' Work and household chores take up most of her weekdays. On weekends, the Catholic devotes her time to church. 'Many of my colleagues are also like me and are single. Work is very stressful so they're happy to go back home and have some quiet time.' As to whether she regrets not having children, she says she pins all her hopes on the offspring of her five siblings. 'I used to take care of them when they were young,' she says of her nine nieces and nephews. 'They call me kai ma (Cantonese for godmother) and visit often.' -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I love my violin more ACCLAIMED Singaporean violinist Min Lee has never dated. After all, she has to juggle daily five-hour practices, go for music classes at the University of Michigan and perform in concerts around the world. But that doesn't mean the 21-year-old, who has signed on with recording label Universal Music, is not looking for love. 'I appreciate cute boys, too,' says the violinist who started playing the instrument when she was two. 'But I've made my choice to focus on my career. Besides, the special one hasn't come along yet.' She entered the Oberlin Conservatory of the Oberlin College in the United States at 13, but was barred from staying in the dormitory. 'The school was afraid of the bad dating influences that 17- to 18-year-old American girls could have on me.' She stayed with her mother off campus. At Yale University, where she received her degree in music, she hung out with single female friends and older guys, who never made her feel weird about not dating. 'My Mum takes charge of my career but she's no dragon lady,' Lee says. 'She'll be like 'go, go, go' for dates, and I'll say 'no, no, no'.' Her 'special one' will, however, have to play second fiddle to Filly, her $1 million Filius Andreas Guarnerius violin. 'If I'm in a sinking ship caught between my boyfriend and Filly, I'll jump in after Filly. 'Hopefully my boyfriend can swim because my violin definitely can't.' http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/lif...68413,00.html? __________________ http://world4.monstersgame.co.uk/?ac=vid&vid=47046984

22-08-2004, 08:18 PM	#2
EjX Status: Its Moo... Join Date: May 2003 Location: --SwiMming PooL-- Posts: 1,803	Re: A kiss is still a miss wow.. long article. anyway, ive no prejudice against anyone who've nv been kissed or dated before. but juz like to share a lil thing.. i hav a friend who had a gf for 3yrs.. n they NEVER KISSED. Onli a mere hug.... So i tink such ppl r worse than those who nv had a relationship. __________________ Just Bintan :sunsmiley Love is an Irresistible Desire to be Irresistibly Desired.

22-08-2004, 08:23 PM	#3
^A\|eX^ Status: ^XiAoBluR^ Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: ^XB^ Posts: 4,775	Re: A kiss is still a miss maybe kt can start a match making agency leh. :fk:

22-08-2004, 08:48 PM	#5
Nbro Status: ZeNiuMaTioN Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: ReD HaiR BridgE Age: 32 Posts: 2,654	Re: A kiss is still a miss anyway, some pple dun have time...... some pple are afraid.... mb seen different pple and know their problems.... so dun dare to take gf/bf.... hence the late r/s or wat.... __________________ PLEASE SIGN MY GUESTBOOK www.mywedding.com/destinytogetherjamesandchooyian/index.html

22-08-2004, 08:52 PM	#6
j20_sg Status: j20_sg's User Title Join Date: May 2003 Age: 22 Posts: 7,097	Re: A kiss is still a miss ....4 more yrs be4 i go into that category!~ __________________ j20_sg's Signature

22-08-2004, 09:11 PM	#7
BlueWater Status: Member Join Date: May 2004 Age: 37 Posts: 166	Re: A kiss is still a miss so what a chim report... __________________ help to adopt Dogs at http://www.lnksremoved.com

22-08-2004, 10:01 PM	#8
antartica Status: antartica Join Date: Jul 2004 Age: 33 Posts: 494	Re: A kiss is still a miss this is interesting... i'm now pushing 30 in a coupla years now. and i've dated several before and of have done many things in my life and after reading the article. i think that it would acfually be nice to be 30 and have a clean slate like what Sharon said... but damn me if i have to spend 16K on a viet wife!

22-08-2004, 10:16 PM	#9
We\|sAu Status: ~Totally in love with her Lubby~ Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Singapore Age: 26 Posts: 6,684	Re: A kiss is still a miss eh..anyone can summarise for me anot..very long lehz..read til giddy..den gif up le.. __________________ http://xiaoxiuxiu1129.blogspot.com

22-08-2004, 11:06 PM	#12
jnifur Status: 沙漠肚皮舞娘 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 迪斯尼舞台 Age: 29 Posts: 8,203	Re: A kiss is still a miss The society is biased against pple who dun marry and lead the correct circle of life. How pathetic. Who are they to judge? Why pple who choose the alternatives are often viewed as freaks? Dun marry is wrong, marry is rite. Who will be in the rite position to say that?